Joint Chiefs of Staff, Constitutional Crisis, January 11, 2009, Doug Schell email, Obama not eligible, Oath of office, Electors failed in duty, Congress failed, Obama not natural born citizen, Uphold and Defend the Constitution of the US, Restore the CONSTITUTIONAL Republic
Citizen Wells published:
From:
Dr. Douglas W. Schell
Chairman, Restore the CONSTITUTIONAL Republic
To:
The Joint Chiefs of Staff
“Sirs:
The United States is facing the worst Constitutional Crisis since South Carolina seceded from the Union. It could well split the military between those who will stand by the Constitution vs. those who stand by traitors in order to keep their military offices. The major difference is that the secession was covered by the media of the day but this crisis is being hidden by the media or when covered, much misinformation has been provided to deceive We the People. When we who know about this crisis try to BUY time on TV, we are refused.
WHO HAVE PROVEN TO BE TRAITORS?
- The Electors failed to do their Constitutional duty after being educated as to the crisis.
- On Jan 8, 2009, the entire Senate and House of Representatives dishonored their oath to sustain and defend the Constitution after also being educated about this crisis.
- The Federal Courts, including the Supreme Court, are using all types of legal technicalities as an excuse not to keep their oath.
The ONLY group that is left to turn to is the military. If you fail us we have two choices left. First, we can submit to the fall of our Constitutional Republic and live under a New World Order or SECOND we can do as the Patriots did in 1776 and win back our liberties under God. I believe most retired military will take that position as I would. “Don’t Tread On Me” will be our theme like it was the former Patriots.
I spent four years as USAF Officer from 1963-1967. Then, I spent 7 years as an Officer in the Indiana Air National Guard while obtaining my Doctorate Degree in Business at Indiana University.
When I was Commissioned as a USAF ROTC Officer at Penn State University in March, 1963, I swore to “Uphold and Defend the Constitution of the USA against ALL enemies foreign and DOMESTIC so help me God.” I have always taken that oath seriously and feel it is still applicable even though I no longer serve in the USAF.
I KNOW that you took that same oath and hold it dear to your heart as I do. I also KNOW that implied within that oath is to follow all orders given by the President as Commander in Chief IF they are Constitutional. That oath clearly places loyalty to the Constitution above anyone who gives unlawful orders, including the POTUS.
BACKGROUND BRIEFING ON THE CRISIS WE FACE
There are three types of citizens.
First is the natural born. This person can run for President if in addition he/she is at least 35 years old and has lived in the USA for 10 years or more. The two relevant requirements to be natural born are listed below.
Second, is the native citizen. This person is born to at least one parent who is an American citizen.
Third, is to become a naturalized citizen through a legally defined process.
It is either the second or third category that Mr. Obama belongs in. In terms of elected office, all three types of citizens can legally run in EXCEPT for the office of POTUS.
THE PROBLEM is that Mr. Obama cannot be Commander in Chief and give any lawful orders to follow. Why? The Constitution REQUIRES that any POTUS be a natural born citizen which entails:
(1) being born on US soil and
(2) having both parents be USA citizens at the time of birth.
Mr. Obama meets neither of these two requirements. His father was a citizen of Kenya. He even admits this in his book. As such, he was a citizen of the British Empire. At that time (1961) one could not have duel citizenship. Citizenship followed the father.
Mr. Obama also was born in Kenya, not as falsely claimed in Hawaii.
Mr. Obama has spent many 1000s of dollars for law firms to make sure NO ONE sees his long form, original, vault birth certificate in Hawaii. The reason is???? We think it’s because the Hawaiian long form, original, vault birth certificate will show that he was physically born in Kenya.
ALL WE HAVE ASKED FOR FROM OBAMA AND THE COURTS IS TO SEE THAT BIRTH CERTIFICATE AND HAVE IT TESTED BY A TEAM OF DOCUMENT FORENSIC SCIENTISTS.
The media has willingly deceived the public by claiming that the CERTIFICATE of BIRTH shows he was physically born in Hawaii. Such websites as FactFinder have willingly and knowingly deceived the public that Mr. Obama has been properly vetted.
I am the Chairman of www.restoretheconstitutionalrepublic.org. We have much information showing that what I’ve said above is true and accurate. The best place to start is at http://restoretheconstitutionalrepublic.org/index.php?board=124.0.
A RECENT SURVEY TAKEN BY THE ARMY TIMES INDICATED THAT OVER 60% OF ACTIVE MILITARY ARE NOT SURE WHETHER THEY CAN FOLLOW THE ORDERS OF MR. OBAMA. THIS IS UNHEARD OF. THIS IS BEFORE THE TRUTH ABOUT MR. OBAMA BEGINS TO SEEP OUT.
Our military is way overextended as you well KNOW. One must have 100% confidence in the validity of orders given and by whom if we are to maintain our freedoms through military action.
It is now up to you to stand up and defend the Constitution against DOMESTIC enemies as you swore you would. How? I know what won’t work because we’ve already petitioned Congress, the Electors, President Bush, the Courts and the Main Stream Media. VP Cheney even broke the law on Jan 8, 2009 when he finished recording the Electoral votes of all 50 States. He was required by law to ask for any objections which can also come from citizens. He purposely failed to do this.
Many petitions for a Call to Order were sent by our volunteers to various Senators and Congressmen demanding a vetting. These too were totally ignored.
ACTIONS NEEDED TO BE TAKEN BY THE JCS.
IF you don’t take action before Jan 20, 2009, you will have proven yourselves to be unworthy to hold your commissions and will have broken a solemn oath you’ve made to defend the Constitution against ALL DOMESTIC enemies. These are hard words but are true words.
YOU ARE WE THE PEOPLES LAST HOPE FOR A PEACEFUL SETTLEMENT OF THIS CONSTITUTIONAL CRISIS. OF ALL AMERICANS I’VE EVER KNOWN IN MY 67 YEARS, THE MILITARY IS THE MOST COURAGEOUS IN DEFENDING OUR CONSTITUTIONAL REPUBLIC TO THE EXTENT OF BEING WILLING TO GIVE UP ONE’S LIFE IF THAT BECOMES NECESSARY.
YOU MUST STAND UP TO AVOID WHAT I BELIEVE WILL BECOME A BLOODY CIVIL WAR. THE PEOPLE ARE NOT GOING TO TAKE TREASON TO THE CONSTITUTION ANY LONGER FROM OUR “REPRESENTATIVE?????”
YOU AND I MUST HONOR THE MILLIONS WHO HAVE GIVEN THEIR LIVES FOR THE CONSTITUTION. WE MUST REMEMBER WHAT THE SIGNERS OF THE DECLARATION OF INDEPENCE WERE WILLING TO DO.
ARE YOU MILITARY LEADERS IN THE GREAT TRADITION OF GENERAL GEORGE WASHINGTON OR IN THE TRADITION OF GENERAL BENEDICT ARNOLD? YOUR ACTIONS IN THE NEXT FEW DAYS WILL LET WE THE PEOPLE KNOW OF WHOM YOUR ROLE MODEL IS.
For a Restored American Constitutional Republic,
Dr. Douglas W. Schell
Chairman, Restore the CONSTITUTIONAL Republic “
The author of this letter/email needs to read the amendments/precedents which has defined what a NBC is since the Constitution was written. He’s got it wrong. And this man is crazy.
http://www.usafrica.us
0bama violated the Logan Act, helped incite genocide of Christians in Kenya, dealing with al Qaeda backed Odinga, Wright and Farrakhan dealing with Moamar Qadafi. Obama, he is the ENEMY himself. How can ANY US military follow him, no way!
Karen,
Please elaborate. Tell me where he is wrong. Specifically.
Natural Born is
jus soli
jus sanguine
and 0bama has not proven either, and can never be jus sanguine
this is born out by
S.R. 511, Perkins v. Elg, U.S. v. Kim Wong Ark, John Bingham father of the 14th Amendment, recent statements by Sen. Leahy and Secretary Chertoff, as well as the obvious Spirit and Intent of the United States Constitution Article II, backed by the grandfather clause allowing the only exception of dual citizenship to those who might run for POTUS a the time of the ratification of the US Constitution.
Further Irony is that 0bama himself cosigned S.R. 511 stating that BOTH PARENTS MUST BE US CITIZENS for a child to be “natural born”.
There is not now, nor has there ever been, any Constitutional requirement that a natural born citizen have citizen parents. It was not in law at the time the Constitution was ratified, is not the in Constitution, it is not in the US Code and it is not in any court decision since. And I challenge anyone who thinks otherwise to cite the section from the Constitution, the provision in the US Code or the court decision that says otherwise (except that it be twisted falsely through logical fallacy). You cannot because it does not exist.
In 1844 a New York judge in the opinion of Lynch v. Clarke said:
“Suppose a person should be elected President who was native born, but of alien parents, could there be any reasonable doubt that he was eligible under the constitution? I think not.”
The analysis of the history of citizenship law supporting the preceding aside comment is as valid today as it was in 1844, and fairly represents the entire history of court statements on this subject. Full text of Lynch available here.
I hope no member of the armed forces will be made into a traitor through the disinformation of legal charlatans.
Yes Karen - please tell us what you’re seeing as wrong with what he says. What part of the NBC do you see has a problem.
Karen IS NOT FULLY EDUCATED as to how US constitution defines Natural Born citizen and American citizen under 14 ADmendment. YOU can be an American citizen,but NOT NATURAL BORN CITIZEN. MOST people don’t know this. The Framers OF constitution referred to LAW OF NATIONS definition as to what NATURAL BORN CITIZEN is. A person born to two American parents,born on US soil. Obama may be American citizen,but IS NOT NATURAL BORN CITIZEN. That is reality. Doug Schell also sees the reality that the MAJORITY OF US military personnel does NOT want to take orders form Obama. This is also a signifigant reality.This man is not crazy and sees that American PEOPLE may not follow obama.
Further Irony is that 0bama himself cosigned S.R. 511 stating that BOTH PARENTS MUST BE US CITIZENS for a child to be “natural born”.
The above is a non-binding Senate Resolution. That means absolutely nothing. show of support for McCain.
There is nowhere in the Constitution where is says that a natural born citizen has to have two parents who are citizens. Nowhere!
Our enlisted military are not foolish enough to follow you to ruin their own military careers. And the few that do, will regret their decision.
There IS NO CONSPIRACY.
Reply to CITIZENWELLS resident 14 yrs to be Pres
Karen, If there is no conspiracy, YOU go get Obama’s birth certificate and stop the tension. You can’t do it, so quite arguing with everyone.
“quit” arguing
Karen, what are your credentials?
What specifically is your answer as to why Obama would spend near a MILLION dollars on Attornies defending his right to keep his ENTIRE birth certificate from being made public
Do you believe he has a legal and/or moral right to keep his BIRTH CERTIFICATE under cover?
Wouldn’t a reasonable or PRUDENT person, as he asserts himself, the PRAGMATIST, do anything and EVERYTHING, including making PUBLIC HIS ENTIRE BIRTH CERTIFICATE in order to quell a possible MILITARY REBELLION?
What is your analysis of the 60% Military uneasy about taking orders from Obama? Shouldn’t Obama, as a public and POTUS make his BIRTH CERTIFICATE in its ENTIRETY available for them to RESTORE order?
What are Obama’s rights to privacy to effect him not carrying out this public display of his ENTIRE BIRTH CERTIFICATE which includes DOCTOR and HOSPITAL information?
Why do you suppose he doesn’t WANT THE PUBLIC TO KNOW who the Doctor or Hospital IS?
I awaited your educated reply
You sir are a traitor to the nation and to your military oath. You are actively calling for a coup as if we were some tin pot banana republic rather than than the oldest Constitutional democracy on the planet. As such, I can assure that your fellow members of the Officer Corps hold you in contempt.
The Term Natural Born is stated, for the office of President. It does not allow for a naturalized citizen. A Foreign Father, campaigning for your Cousin of another Country is a crime against America. Obama is NOT a Natural Born Citizen. To Allow him the office is a crime agaist America. All invovled with said crime scall be Prosecuted to the fullest. Now if the Constitution becomes void, all Laws created from sad paper become void. Now that the death of America has come, there are no longer any laws in America.
I think this 14th Amendment argument just about sums it up as a precedent for the O case
United States v. Wong Kim Ark, 169 U.S. 649 (1898): It was held that a person born within the jurisdiction of the U.S. to non-citizens who “are not employed in any diplomatic or official capacity” is automatically a citizen, per the Fourteenth Amendment. The majority also mentioned what the situation was prior to the Fourteenth Amendment and the U.S. Constitution, by quoting Emerich de Vattel: “The natives, or natural-born citizens, are those born in the country of parents who are citizens. As the society cannot exist and perpetuate itself otherwise than by the children of the citizens, those children naturally follow the condition of their fathers, and succeed to all their rights.” Dissenters in Wong Kim Ark wrote: “it is unreasonable to conclude that ‘natural born citizen’ applied to everybody born within the geographical tract known as the United States, irrespective of circumstances; and that the children of foreigners, happening to be born to them while passing through the country, whether of royal parentage or not, or whether of the Mongolian, Malay, or other race, were eligible to the presidency, while children of our citizens, born abroad, were not.”[14] The majority opinion in Wong Kim Ark did not explicitly disagree with this comment of the dissenters, and instead merely observed that: “The constitution nowhere defines the meaning of these words [citizen and natural born citizen], either by way of inclusion or of exclusion, except in so far as this is done by the affirmative declaration that ‘all persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States.’”[14]
WestPointGrad you should know that aiding a usurper into the Whitehouse is a crime to the Constitution, you should know that taking orders from the Usurper once in Office constitutes treason.
Therefore Sir I have to remind you of the fact that you swore to “Uphold and Defend the Constitution of the USA against ALL enemies foreign and DOMESTIC so help me God.”
?
Sir your right on we are coming close to the line in the sand ,And we will have to pic sides as before.As for the news of the day Scotus is not willing to put there name down and a pound of flesh,We will have to do this, As our forefathers did with the King.Our military people need to close ranks and inform us how to help .But we need to keep with the law of the land and when that has no hope then we have no choice.Remember of founding fathers were called traitors.
You people need to “get a grip.” You take things out of context, misrepresent facts and tell outright lies. There is NO evidence whatsoever to any of your allegations. Might be a clue as to why these petitions/applications have been denied by the courts. Might also be a clue as to why traditional media is not “reporting this.” Might also be a clue as to why our elected officials are not responding to all the “petitions, open letters, demands, etc.”
You better think long and hard before you “revolt.” Admiral Mullen was interviewed on 60 Minutes. Admiral Mullen clearly stated that the military is apolitical and that he (Admiral Mullen) will be working for President Obama once he (Obama) is inaugerated.
Karen,
There is no “out of context here”. Understand the facts.
FACT 1: Obama admits dual citizenship at birth.
FACT 2: Obama admits he let his citizenship lapse with Kenya. Unfortunately for him he never admits to renouncing his British citizenship after age 18 as required by the British Nationality Act of 1948. And since he was not a resident of Kenya at the time, he retained his British citizenship, Kenyan citizenship, and U.S. citizenship (see Dual Citizenship section under Kenyan Constitution).
FACT 3: De Vattel’s Law of Nations (the holy grail of the Constitution framers) defines Natural Born Citizenship to be born to at least a citizen father on sovereign soil. The supreme court has used the Law of Nations repeatedly over the past 200 years whenever international law is in question (which it clearly is in this case). Scalia has even referenced it in a case in early 2008.
FACT 4: British Common law defined Natural born subjects to be British born to the father during the time of the American Revolution. Natural Born means just that, born under Natural law, i.e. born to the father. Almost every other country in the world understands Natural Law to be “citizenship passed down by the father to the son/daughter”, even today. We as Americans are idiots. We think all other nations are as liberal as we are regarding citizenship. The framers used this concept, but changed the subject to citizenship as we are a republic, not a monarchy.
FACT 5: Perkins v. Elg has given examples of Natural Born Citizens, and Obama would not be classified as a Natural Born Citizen based on their decision.
FACT 6: Obama admitted he was a “Citizen of the World”. You can’t be a Citizen of the World and owe allegiance to the United States. Sorry, it can’t be done.
FACT 7: Stanley Ann Dunham was not old enough to pass citizenship to Obama by herself. U.S. Statute was written to prevent generations of U.S. citizens being born overseas to underaged, single, and/or non-resident citizens.
FACT 8: Amendment 14 was designed to make blacks Citizens instead of property, not to clarify what the words “Natural Born” meant. The intent was never to make them Natural Born Citizens. After all, slaves couldn’t vote then, and therefore no one would elect them as President because no blacks would be able to vote for him anyway.
FACT 9: US Wong Ark Kim clarified “Native Born” status, which is not the same as “Natural Born” status. Native Born means born on U.S. soil. Natural Born means born on U.S. soil to a citizen father (do I have to mention Natural Law again?). Interestingly enough Obama on his own site uses “Native Born” instead of “Natural Born”. Why is that? A: Obama knows he’s not Natural Born. Obama know’s he’s Native Born, i.e. born in Hawaii.
FACT 10: Obama promised “transparency” during his campaign. Instead we see a proverbial FT. KNOX surrounding any and all paperwork that would vet him as a candidate and clarify his citizenship status, let alone his natural born citizenship status.
FACT 11: Loyal Citizens of the United States are proud of their nation and would cart their paperwork on a giant stick and parade it around the Capitol Building instead of hide it under a legal rock. If you were up for POTUS, would you hide your paperwork telling the world you are “one of us loyal Natural Born Citizens”? Wait, don’t answer that.
FACT 12: It is generally understood by the U.S. State Department that Natural Born Citizens are ones born to two citizen parents on U.S. soil (what a concidence!). A simple search on their web site will tell you this. They do, however, admit that the supreme court has never truly clarified what it means (they’re wrong of course, but that’s a different topic of discussion).
FACT 13: Our framers knew dual citizenship at birth was BAD. So BAD in fact, the U.S. fought the British in the War of 1812 over it.
FACT 14: As we all know, Obama “signed off” on SR 511, which stated Natural Born Citizens are born to 2 citizen parents. Although it is not law, it is a legal document that can be used to clarify Obama’s understanding of its definition. We know he knows that we know he’s not eligible.
The fact that most of the major media has censored the Obama natural born citizenship story from the people also brings another crisis upon us. The Constitution and other laws have given the Press freedoms and privileges to help have a free society yet now we have the Press and media promoting a personal agenda undermining traditional journalism and manipulating the people by ignoring the Obama birth issue and giving him unprecedented favorable coverage. Up until this week, you would be hard pressed to come up with one unfavorable story about Obama anywhere in the main press and media.
One of the actions that will be apparent after this Obama mess is dealt with, and it will be dealt with and not ignored, is that Congress will need to deregulate the main press since they have now become a danger to the American people. About half a dozen main news outfits control most of the news now and there will need to be deregulation to combat that control. There needs to be room for other independent TV networks besides ABC, CBS or NBC which are still heavy players in giving out the news. People who want some kind of ‘fairness doctrine”, well here you go. Also with the recent FCC segmentation of the radio band widths, there needs to be more accessibility to owning and starting radio stations since it is very hard to do so now even for those with the finances to do so. We need to keep this issue in mind during this Constitutional crisis.
Our military may be a factor if any of the three branches of the federal government fail to investigate Obama and qualify him for the highest office in the land. I will wait for now and will not comment more on that unless the situation requires it but be assured that the people of this Constitutional Republic (not Democracy) have another legal formidable way available to them if the 3 main branches of government fail to act or if then the Joint Chiefs of Staff were to also fail to act. It is a simple yet brilliant action that could work should it be necessary.
JeffM,
Many of your “facts” are incorrect and misleading. I suggest you start with the article below to re-educate yourself regarding what is “actually factual” regarding this issue:
http://www.obamaconspiracy.org/2009/01/natural-born-citizenship-for-dummies/comment-page-1/?replytocom=1417
JeffM,
This is a statement you made that is factual: “They do, however, admit that the supreme court has never truly clarified what it means”
You and I can debate all day long regarding the definition of “natural born citizen”, but there are only two entities who have the power to define natural born citizen.
1. Congress with a congressional amendment to the Constitution.
2. U.S. Supreme Court decision.
karen, you sound like an obama worshiper. The fact of the matter is that obama is a lier. If you don’t like the information this site has for you, than go back to the blogs that say what you want to hear, there a lot of them out there. Most of us frequent this site for information and updates. Get your facts and listen to this all the way though, maybe you’ll get a clue.
http://www.oilforimmigration.org/facts/?p=735
You keep dreaming that your messiah will give you all you ever dreamed of, one day you’ll find yourself along with all who lifted up the beast, in a nightmare you’ll never wake up from. I truly pray this will never happen, but if/when it does, America will have to thank people like you, who instead of seeking the Truth, followed a lie. Instead of standing up for freedom and liberty, you would rather argue against the Constitution.
GOD BLESS AMERICA and the FREEDOM she offers to all who come to her. Oh and GOD BLESS YOU karen, I pray that you will never have to live in a place where the government will tell you what you can and can’t do, what you can and can’t say. what you can and can’t believe in.
AmericanPride,
Obama is no “messiah.” By the same token, he is no beast. He is just a man, flesh and blood, like all other men. And I don’t expect Obama to give me anything. I work and have since I was a teenager.
All governments tell their citizens what they can and cannot do to some degree. They are called laws. Some governments are just more restrictive in what they allow their citizens to do. American citizens have rights but where my rights end is where another’s rights begin. Generally, laws are passed when someone tramples on another’s rights.
Instead of running around chasing some imaginary “conspiracy”, we should all be united trying to figure out how we can assist our government officials to get us out of the mess we are in. There is blame to go around for everyone for this mess we find ourselves in today.
God Bless America and God Bless you too.
karen,
Hitler also was considered “just a man, flesh and blood”, that didn’t stop him from committing atrocities to many.
I agree that all governments have laws but, we, as Americans have been blessed to have the freedoms that are bestowed upon us by God through the constitution. It’s the constitution that has protected our country and our people from tyranny. It is the constitution that has given American the courage to stand up and fight for others who have not been so blessed. It is the constitution that separates America from the rest. If we don’t stand and protect the rights this document gives us as people, who will protect us from those that want to destroy us. We must stand our ground and not let any of it be taken out without due process.
obama has already said, “we the people? just words” this document is not just words it is the law of Our Land!!! It is what holds America together and safe. We cannot pick and choose what part of it we are going to uphold, we need to uphold all of it. The blood of our for-fathers has been shed to bring it to you and me, and we must bring it intact to our children’s children. The children who live now, may not understand what is happening right now, but , we must pass these freedoms down to them.
What will we tell them if they live in concentration camps? Will we be telling them stories of how we used to ride our bikes where ever we wanted, play ball when ever we wanted, go to concerts, go to ball games, drive, get burgers and fries when ever we wanted. And you can’t promise that these thing will be available to them, because you don’t know what a usurper would do to our rights.
http://halturnershow.blogspot.com/2008/12/video-prisoner-transport-rail-cars.html
Karen, you need to study history better. “all governments tell their citizens what they can and cannot do to some degree”
1) Have you ever heard of “government for the people, by the people”? how about “when the people are no longer served, IT IS THEIR DUTY to take up arms and overthrow”….how does that resonate with you Karen?
2) Haven’t you noticed we are amping up into a police state, dear Karen? what do you do for a living?
Get real, and get your head out of the golden sand.
All the financial posturing and talk…is just the download of the program to take a financial/constitutional enema to the foundations of this country.
The “Economic Recovery” will never work, why?
Because as Perot put it, in 1992, what I have practiced and believed for near 20 years now, is the “slow sucking sound out of the country of jobs”…the effect thereof, is that wE ARE BEING INTEGRATED with the rest of the world. OUR STANDARD OF LIVING HAS TO come down, it is simple economics. I am a trained CPA, there is no more “American Dream”, there are no jobs to uphold the mortgage/children path of the family. We are being financially and educationally “dummed down” with the rest of the world. The borders are down, the stakes are HIGH–YOURS.
Now deal with it. ACCEPT your lost standard of living, and dreams of your descendants, pitch in , because the rest of the world is now at your door with a hand out wanting what your forefathers and mothers fought and died for centuries ago. I am a direct descendant of 2 presidents, my family came in in the 1600’s and its going out with a bang!
God Bless and Rooty Tooty to all the Sweetness and Light peddlars!!
Sell it on the corner, Matchbook Girl!!
“IT IS THEIR DUTY to take up arms and overthrow”….how does that resonate with you Karen?”
This sounds like treason to me and I suspect if you will check, this is what our government calls it too. And, I suspect there are many government agencies watching these websites to see who are making these types of statements. Patriots?–not even close–”just a angry mob that didn’t win the election.”
“We must stand our ground and not let any of it be taken out without due process.”
You need to go actually read the Constitution. Nothing has been taken out–in fact, there is not a provision in the Constitution for anyone to take anything out of the Constitution, however, the Constitution can and has been amended and interpreted by Congress and the U.S. Supreme Court.
is that a threat Karen? Are you working for “them”
But Article III, section 3 of the U.S. Constitution is both inclusive and specific in its definition: “Treason against the United States, shall consist only in levying war against them, or in adhering to their enemies, giving them aid and comfort.” Two witnesses or a confession in open court are required for conviction.
NOWHERE did I speak of levying WAR AGAINST THE STATES, my dear
and please know, I adhere to no one
Dear Karen in answer to JeffM you wrote:
In fact on obamaconspiracy you, asuming that you use the name Dr. Conspiracy there, answered as follows:
Could you enlighten me as to why you consider
unfair in particular as you can hardly deny the fact that Obama indeed erected a proverbial FT. KNOX . around himself. Earlier you hinted at paperwork so maybe now you could expand a little on that.
Self-defense is the only exception to the use of force set forth in the United Nations Charter in article 51. [2] Second, representative democracy is intrinsic in every international human rights agreement that presupposes the people have the right to rise up and overthrow a non-democratic form of government.
The Second Amendment is primarily intended to defend against the tyranny of government.
The Founders added the 2nd Amendment so that after an extended (rightly to be determined by the majority of “we the people”) period of abuse, a government exhibits a obvious design to set upon and against our natural rights, we will have the means to protect and recover our rights. That is why the right to keep and bear arms was included in the Bill of Rights, if we make the judgment that our rights are being systematically violated, we have not merely the right, but the duty, to resist and overthrow the power responsible. That duty requires that we always maintain the material capacity to resist tyranny, and that we communicate that material capacity to any perceived purveyor of government tyranny.
Case in point, YOU, dear Karen
sally manor you are certainly right. Your quote:
would fully apply to the usurper and those aiding or taking orders from him. In fact, as acts of usurpation and tyranny could not be imputed to their offices or to the government at all, but would amount to nothing but the depredations of mere private criminals, ant form of cooperation would constitute treason following the definition as the term “enemies” applies both external as internal.
David Crockett,
I am not Dr. Conspiracy so I cannot respond. My given name is Karen. You will need to ask Dr. Conspiracy to get answers to your questions. I’m sure Dr. Conspiracy would welcome you to the website. Unlike other websites, there is no censorship unless you are abusive. Facts are presented there, not fiction backed by evidence, not heresay and fabricated evidence.
Sally,
Here was what you said: “IT IS THEIR DUTY to take up arms and overthrow”
You are implying violence against our soon to be President and our current PE. That would be considered war against our President.
“is that a threat Karen? Are you working for “them”
What is it in my post that you consider a threat? I do not see anything in my post that could be regarded as a threat. And I don’t work for anybody except myself.
“Civil war” that all of you imply is against your government.
Dear Karen, I wasn’t sure about the name but okay that is cleared up. Of course I understand you cannot answer for Dr. Conspiracy however you may have an own opinion on the subject.
In particular as you wrote:
Now speaking about fabricated evidence implies a rather serious accusation, so I would ask you to substatiate it in a point by point fashion.
In respect to your answer to Sally
To overthrow doesn’t neccesairly imply direct violence applied to individuals. This for clarity.
You speak of our President, however the usurper cannot be regarded as such. rather we should speak of “gangster perverting the office of President.”
Per “Karen”
“Sally,
Here was what you said: “IT IS THEIR DUTY to take up arms and overthrow”
You are implying violence against our soon to be President and our current PE. That would be considered war against our President.
“is that a threat Karen? Are you working for “them”
What is it in my post that you consider a threat?”
I consider you saying I am threatening a act of violence against the PE a “threat” in and of itself–in your current post
In your prior post I consider your threat of governmental action against me exercising my free speech rights in QUOTING THE CONSITUTION AND THE BILL OF RIGHTS as a THREAT
…simple as that, my dear
My words are in reference to making sure the CONSTITUTION IS UPHELD AND FOLLOWED, NOT IN REFERENCE TO ANY SORT OF PHYSICAL THREAT AGAINST THE PE OR ANY GOVERNMENTAL PERSON< we are strictly talking allegory here and you need to STOP in your drive to define the people posting here as violent individuals
Do you uphold the second amendment or the bill of rights-Karen?
I will respond to David first:
I have not seen one shred of “evidence” that proves the following allegations:
1. the COLB is fake
2. Obama was born in Kenya
3. Obama’s 1/2 sister has a Hawaiian BC
4. Obama had a Pakistan passport
5. Obama was adopted by Lolo Soetoro
6. Obama is a Muslim
7. Affidavits of 2nd hand information/questionable tapes.
8. Obama is a Indonesian citizen.
May I suggest you go read this website: whatsyourevidence.com
The above website provides concise, accurate information and sources that debunk your claims.
That is just for starters.
I consider PE Obama the President as he was elected by both popular and EC votes, you know–We, the people elected PE Obama. If you don’t, then that is your problem, not mine.
Now Sally,
Your statement: “IT IS THEIR DUTY to take up arms and overthrow”
The above statement implies violence/use of force. You said it, posted it, I did not. And my post did not imply governmental action against you or anyone else on this blog. Threats are just that until you act on those threats which I pray none of you actually do. I hope all of this is just talk with no action. However, I have already seen numerous people/posters state that they had reported many of these blogs/websites to the FBI because of their concerns. This is not meant as a threat either, simply a observation.
And, yes, I uphold the 2nd amendment and the Bill of Rights and the Constitution.
Well Karen with all due respect I wonder where you have been the last few weeks.
The COLB was taken apart by Polarik.
Nobody claimed that he had a Pakistan passport, there is an issue about him visiting Pakistan when it was off limits for American Passport holder. Given that 1) he could not have attended an Indonesian School, when he did, due Indonesian Law 2) his school registration shows his nationality as Indonesian and his religion as Muslim.
I suggest you do some further research on this site before claiming that there is no shred of evidence. But tell me why does Barack keep all his paperwork under seal if he would be spotless.
Karen,
Everything I have said is factual. We do not need the supreme court to dictate what is factual. We only need the supreme court to awknowledge these facts to be the letter of the law as it pertains to the U.S. Constitution and uphold its words.
I would like you to refute my facts based on proof, and how it pertains to judgement in the judicial branch of the United States without quoting another site. May I suggest you start with historical documentation starting around 1718 and work your way up from there. Then, work your way over to International Law, British Law, and Kenyan Law.
Per Karen:
“Your statement: “IT IS THEIR DUTY to take up arms and overthrow”
The above statement implies violence/use of force. You said it, posted it, I did not. ”
Study history dear Karen, I was QUOTING the 2nd amendment/bill of rights
please go back and re read my post that ALSO links these actions (right of the individual to “overthrow” govt) to the specific code of the UNITED NATIONS re: the sovereign rights of the individual world wide (re: overthrow) as well….
BUT MORE IMPORTANTLY…you need to re read my fourth or fifth BACK post that specifically says “OVER THROW if a MAJORITY of “WE the People” are of the SAME mindset”….I am perfectly aware that a MAJORITY of the people elected Obama and give deference, when and if due, to his standing as PE, my argumentative points are in his refusal to SET THE RECORD STRAIGHT
WHO IS THE DOCTOR, WHERE IS THE HOSPITAL…
Barack, I’m awaiting your concern for “We the People”, be the Pragmatist and DEAL
Until then, I am steadfast in upholding these principals and garnering truth for others, no matter the outcome
Per Karen-Round two:
“And my post did not imply governmental action against you or anyone else on this blog.”
…Oh YES, it did, the mere mention of such a thing was to induce fear to succomb from posting such mindset…you are obviously on “CLEAN UP DUTY”
OWN IT!!
David,
Where have you been. There have been allegations that PE Obama had to have a Indonesian passport to travel to Indonesia when he was 20 yrs. old–gee did you miss that? May I direct you to: http://whatsyourevidence.com/
Polarik? Yea right!–again, may I direct you to: http://whatsyourevidence.com/
Regarding Pakistan citizenship:
According to the US Nationality Act of 1940, Section 401:
“A person who is a national of the United States, whether by birth or naturalization, shall lose his nationality by: (a) Obtaining naturalization in a foreign state, either upon his own application or through the naturalization of a parent having legal custody of such person: Provided, however, That nationality not be lost as the result of the naturalization of a parent unless and until the child shall have attained the age of twenty-three years without acquiring permanent residence in the United States:…..”
Section 407:
“A person having American nationality, who is a minor and is residing in a foreign state with or under the legal custody of a parent who loses American nationality under section 404 of this Act, shall at the same time lose his American nationality if such minor has or acquires the nationality of such foreign state: Provided, That, in such case, American nationality shall not be lost as the result of loss of American nationality by the parent unless and until the child attains the age of twenty-three years without having acquired permanent residence in the United States.”
The Nationality Act of 1940 was amended in 1952. Section 349 (a) says:
“From and after the effective date of this Act a person who is a national of the United States whether by birth or naturalization, shall lose his nationality by — (1) obtaining naturalization in a foreign state upon his own application, upon an application filed in his behalf by a parent, or duly authorized agent, or through the naturalization of a parent having legal custody of such person: Provided, That nationality shall not be lost by any person under this section as the result of the naturalization of a parent or parents while such person is under the age of twenty-one years, or as the result of naturalization obtained on behalf of a person under twenty-one years of age by a parent, guardian, or duly authorized agent, unless such person shall fail to enter the United States to establish a permanent residence prior to his twenty-fifth birthday: ….
Section 355:
“A person having United States nationality, who is under the age of twenty-one and whose residence is in a foreign state with or under the legal custody of a parent who hereafter loses United States nationality under section 350 or 352 of this title, shall also lose his United States nationality if such person has or acquires the nationality of such foreign state: Provided, That, in such case, United States nationality shall not be lost as the result of loss of United States nationality by the parent unless and until the person attains the age of twenty-five years without having established his residence in the United States.”
So, according to US law, there’s no way Barack Obama could have lost his US citizenship as a minor, and would have only lost it if his mother renounced her citizenship AND he lived outside the United States until after his 25th birthday.
Now for the Indonesian side of it:
The law in question is # 62/1958, passed on 29 July 1958. It’s interesting in that it’s based on jus sanguinis or parentage, rather than the US jus soli, place of birth. It does not recognize dual citizenship or no citizenship. It was in effect until 2006.
Indonesian citizenship is given to:
A child born of the marriage of an Indonesian couple;
A child born of the marriage of an Indonesian man and foreign woman — the status of which does not cause dual citizenship;
A child born of the marriage of a foreign man and Indonesian woman, both of whom request Indonesian citizenship for their child — the status of which does not cause dual citizenship;
A child born to an unmarried Indonesian woman, the status of which does not cause dual citizenship;
A child born in Indonesian territory that is not provided with citizenship by his or her parents;
A child born in Indonesian territory whose parents are unknown;
A child born in Indonesian territory whose parents have no citizenship.
In addition, it states that:
An infant whose father is a foreign citizen and mother is an Indonesian can obtain Indonesian citizenship if it is the wish of their parents. This citizenship, however, must not cause dual citizenship.
A child born overseas to an Indonesian couple can be an Indonesian citizen at the request of their parents. A request for citizenship must be submitted to the Indonesian embassy no later than three months after the child’s birth, the draft revision says.
A foreign child aged below 21 and unmarried, who is adopted by an Indonesian, will be eligible for Indonesian citizenship if the process does not cause dual citizenship.
Foreigners who contribute to Indonesia — or for a specific reason — can be granted Indonesian citizenship by the President with the consent of the House of Representatives.
http://www.expat.or.id/info/revisiontocitizenshiplaw.html
http://www.kabar-irian-.com/pipermail/kabar-indonesia/2006-July/008614.html
So, according to Indonesian law at the time, an adoptive child would only gain Indonesian citizenship if the process does not cause dual citizenship since, according to US law at the time, there is no way for a minor to renounce his or her citizenship before their 21st birthday.
In addition, an Indonesian citizen can lose their nationality if they live overseas for a consecutive period of five years without declaring their will to remain an Indonesian national.
Which means there is no way Lolo Soetoro could have ever legally had Indonesian citizenship granted to Barack Obama even if he DID adopt him. Lolo Soetoro and Stanley Ann Dunham divorced in 1980 according to papers filed in Hawaii. Barack Obama would have been 19 at that time, and had lived outside of Indonesia for 9 years. Meaning by the time Obama could theoretically renounce his US citizenship, there was no way he could have gained Indonesian citizenship because his mother’s marriage to Lolo Soetoro was null and void.
Bottom line. Neither Barack Obama or his mother could renounce his US citizenship while still a minor, due to US law. Lolo Soetoro, even if he did adopt Barack Obama, could not have arranged for Indonesian citizenship for him without violating Indonesian law. And by the time Obama was old enough to legally renounce his US citizenship if he wanted to, he had lived in the US for over 10 years and his mother and Lolo Soetoro were divorced.
Oh, and by the way, regarding the Indonesian school registration, you left out that it clearly states that Obama was born in Hawaii. Slip your mind? Bit of “cherry picking”?
JeffM,
You are stating your opinion, not facts. Explain this:
http://www.usconstitution.net/consttop_citi.html
Natural-born citizen
Who is a natural-born citizen? Who, in other words, is a citizen at birth, such that that person can be a President someday?
The 14th Amendment defines citizenship this way: “All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside.” But even this does not get specific enough. As usual, the Constitution provides the framework for the law, but it is the law that fills in the gaps.
Currently, Title 8 of the U.S. Code fills in those gaps. Section 1401 defines the following as people who are “citizens of the United States at birth:”
Anyone born inside the United States *
Any Indian or Eskimo born in the United States, provided being a citizen of the U.S. does not impair the person’s status as a citizen of the tribe
Any one born outside the United States, both of whose parents are citizens of the U.S., as long as one parent has lived in the U.S.
Any one born outside the United States, if one parent is a citizen and lived in the U.S. for at least one year and the other parent is a U.S. national
Any one born in a U.S. possession, if one parent is a citizen and lived in the U.S. for at least one year
Any one found in the U.S. under the age of five, whose parentage cannot be determined, as long as proof of non-citizenship is not provided by age 21
Any one born outside the United States, if one parent is an alien and as long as the other parent is a citizen of the U.S. who lived in the U.S. for at least five years (with military and diplomatic service included in this time)
A final, historical condition: a person born before 5/24/1934 of an alien father and a U.S. citizen mother who has lived in the U.S.
* There is an exception in the law - the person must be “subject to the jurisdiction” of the United States. This would exempt the child of a diplomat, for example, from this provision.
Anyone falling into these categories is considered natural-born, and is eligible to run for President or Vice President. These provisions allow the children of military families to be considered natural-born, for example.
Separate sections handle territories that the United States has acquired over time, such as Puerto Rico (8 USC 1402), Alaska (8 USC 1404), Hawaii (8 USC 1405), the U.S. Virgin Islands (8 USC 1406), and Guam (8 USC 1407). Each of these sections confer citizenship on persons living in these territories as of a certain date, and usually confer natural-born status on persons born in those territories after that date. For example, for Puerto Rico, all persons born in Puerto Rico between April 11, 1899, and January 12, 1941, are automatically conferred citizenship as of the date the law was signed by the President (June 27, 1952). Additionally, all persons born in Puerto Rico on or after January 13, 1941, are natural-born citizens of the United States. Note that because of when the law was passed, for some, the natural-born status was retroactive.
The law contains one other section of historical note, concerning the Panama Canal Zone and the nation of Panama. In 8 USC 1403, the law states that anyone born in the Canal Zone or in Panama itself, on or after February 26, 1904, to a mother and/or father who is a United States citizen, was “declared” to be a United States citizen. Note that the terms “natural-born” or “citizen at birth” are missing from this section.
In 2008, when Arizona Senator John McCain ran for president on the Republican ticket, some theorized that because McCain was born in the Canal Zone, he was not actually qualified to be president. However, it should be noted that section 1403 was written to apply to a small group of people to whom section 1401 did not apply. McCain is a natural-born citizen under 8 USC 1401(c): “a person born outside of the United States and its outlying possessions of parents both of whom are citizens of the United States and one of whom has had a residence in the United States or one of its outlying possessions, prior to the birth of such person.” Not eveyone agrees that this section includes McCain - but absent a court ruling either way, we must presume citizenship.
David,
Forgot to provide the links to the info so you could verify the information provided is factual:
Nationality Act of 1940, Chapter 3, §§ 301-322.
Nationality Act of 1940, Chapter 3, §§ 323-334.
Nationality Act of 1940, Chapter 3, §§ 335-336.
Nationality Act of 1940, Chapter 3, §§ 337-347.
Nationality Act of 1940, Chapter 4, §§ 401-410.
1952 Immigration and Nationality Act, Title III, Chapter 1.
1952 Immigration and Nationality Act, Title III, Chapter 3.
Sally,
“I am perfectly aware that a MAJORITY of the people elected Obama ”
Well, at least we agree on something. All of you keep saying “where is the media, where is Congress, where is the U.S. Supreme Court Judges, etc., etc. Hasn’t the thought ever crossed your minds that your allegations lack credibility? No media, no Congress and no U.S. Supreme Court = No credibility.
Again, I urge all three of you to go read the information provided at this website:
http://whatsyourevidence.com/
Goodnight!
Fogot to add this website which is also very good.
http://obamaconspiracy.org/
Facts, not fiction with sources provided to back up the facts.
http://restoretheconstitutionalrepublic.org/index.php?PHPSESSID=oei4tr4b346lnkukaakdfuu3j3&topic=2413.msg
Go to this site!Is this for real?I truly hope so!
Here are some more good websites regarding this subject:
http://www.obamaconspiracy.org/2009/01/independent-grandmother-transcript/
http://www.obamaconspiracy.org/2009/01/factchecking-lynn-stuters-latest/
It seems to me that karen is an obamniac (how she insists that we see it her way), maybe she is getting paid to monitoring this site for obama and his thugs. We should just let her show her ignorants and not pay her any mind. When the s**t hits the fan, SHE WILL remember our word.
God bless America
Karen I hope you won’t mind my question…if I had evidence of anything on your list will you believe it?
Have you seen the ODM Campaign Strategy? I went to Hawaii, Maya Soetoro-Ng told me he was a Muslim. I am sick and tired of looking for more proof. I have it, and I demand a damn response from Barry Soetoro for his legal name change and his vault birth certificate. Because by God I had to mail my original COB to get a Passport. I couldn’t get a notarized certified copy or anything else. As a citizen I am demanding this. I think you had better check around, the military won’t be following his orders. They can’t take sides in elections etc…but they are quite educated and quite informed about what is going on. How many thousands of hours must one put in…I am so sick of defending this. JUST AGREE HE SHOULD SHOW THE VAULT COB. Can we agree on that? What is the problem? It is our Country and I want to know. My husband and of course all of our friends…Fighter Pilots. Who are the heros? Who do the people support? The Troops…that is who…and by God they will not listen to a Usurper without seeing proof of otherwise. Stop insulting these people and their intelligence. We don’t have to be violent.
There are many ways to bring a Country to a standstill, what would that do economically to us right now. I do believe it would be more effective negotiating power at the table than violence, what the hell do they care if we all kill ourselves. Less work for them. I am educated and won’t kill for anyone. I have learned from History. We have more power now than ever.
I say let the NEGOTIATIONS BEGIN. How many military friends do the Democrats really have when push comes to shove ROTFLOL.
Financial standstill….
Seriously what can they do? No one can stop me. Boycott the Country. What are they going to do? Have their civilian force hold guns to our heads and make us spend money? We can organize and implement before 1/20/09. Any thoughts on this are welcome.
Begin before 1/20/09 and if we don’t get to see the vault copy then we just continue. We aren’t going to turn to the streets, we are civilized. Let’s him them where it really hurts. There are many Companies we already all boycott. Let’s start a list. I would love for every Company in America to be Boycotted for a week. Volunteers? Suggestions, ideas or support all welcome. Save the Obama support or arguments for their side. We see through it as a diversionary tactic now from the Obama side to confuse and mislead, sending us back yet again to support or prove our proof now.
We are the ones supporting the economy, we pay taxes. I will be damned if I will let “Karen” or anyone else accuse us of treason for quoting the Constitution. Let me tell you something. The Military defends this Country and our Constitution. We will be quoting plenty of it and don’t anyone dare say that is treason.
They call me Stealth Mom
It is because I volunteered thousands of hours undercover to bust the parents and children who gave my kid and others drugs.
I have found my latest mission Barack to be an even bigger success. Never meant to investigate him, it’s just I kept finding out more. I do hate someone that messes with my God, my family or my freedom.
I hope we can end the discussion with arguing over our proof with anyone more folks like Karen. Sorry she is far from the amount of time or money we have all spent on this. It is a diversionary tactic. Please I was just saying today how fast we were researching and building our cases much faster with more bodies helping. Do not let her stop us from using time wisely now. Hope everyone has a great day tomorrow and I am going to say a really sincere prayer tonight for our cause. I hope you all do the same and maybe we can really make some progress.
Dear Karen still can’t keep it simple and stick to the facts
Who is the Doctor? What Hospital?
notice she refused to answer this in her illustrious “Proof”
Tonya: Props to you , I completely agree re: the economic approach, HOWEVER
YES,,,we NEED TO HIT THE STREETS
As a co owner of presses, we are going to start em rolling with the truth
we need a two–woops THREE fold approach
1) Flyers for distribution, but more importantly, BUMPER STICKERS
2) FEDERAL buildings need someone outside distributing INFO
3) ECONOMIC APPROACH:
Let’s get a website, with the server located offshore
make it a website that lists ALL CORPORATE OBAMA contributors/individuals
and then LINK ALL BUSINESS’ ASSOCIATED THEREWITH
AND BOY COTT
Mass emailing to said organizations before hand
ALSO ALL NON PROFIT
lets start right here:
WHO OR WHAT IS THE ANNENBERG foundation associated with?
BOYCOTT EM’
ALL OF THESE PEOPLE SUPPORT the lie!!
Thank you Sally, let’s work harder and faster.
I know that Karen is on this site to monitor our comments and send us looking some more. Like I said, we have enough proof. Re: taking to the streets. I am all for it, peacefully though and I believe this Country needs to see this exists. If people see how large our numbers are they will join us. Right now we appear outwardly as the conspiracy theorists (a term I never believed would be used to describe me lol). It is important to show our strength. We need a day of protest to kick this off. I personally am willing to drive or fly and participate in a large show of strength. If I can campaign all over the Country or travel on vacation I can afford to do it for this Country.
We should speak w/ David Crockett about compiling on the new site?
The Anneberg group is here in Chicago. Bill Ayers and Barack are on the board together, over 100,000,000 was funneled through them and their failed projects, never even completed mission statement. Their office address appears on 1998 tax returns of Obama and Ayers.
We need to infiltrate the bots, and infiltrate every level of government even if we have to pretend to be supportive of “that one”. This has already started. From low positions to the highest, we need to subvert them from within, just as they have done to the regular people. After all their spew, it’s really easy to imitate a pathetic bot.
Obama cosponsored SR 511 which says that a child born of US CITIZENS (plural) is natural born. It was a fake token to likewise ineligible McCain to “lay off” the natural born issue during the campaign.
The intent of the Constitution is to prevent anyone with divided allegiances/loyalties, from being POTUS. Obama campaigned for Odinga (acting as a Kenyan citizen) violating the Logan Act while a US Senator in 8/07 and was born a Kenyan citizen by his own admissions. What’s key in interpreting citizenship is both birth and behavior. http://www.usafrica.us
American Samoa Congressman Eni Faleomaevega was dispatched to Indonesia in 07 to bribe officials and to lift American interests in protecting West Papuans, in exchange for censoring Barry’s Indonesian citizenship docs, however AP has a photo of his PUBLIC school registration showing he’s an Indonesian citizen, who never renaturalized, Michelle never filed naturalization papers, and so he is still and only is, an Indonesian citizen.